Improving Day 1 Experience
#1
I've been playing lately for long hours and I've been meeting with new players which needed help. I also needed help when I first got here and I was lucky to find it. But even then I almost gave up on trying. It was difficult to start and enjoy the game, I didn't know what to do, where to go, I kept running, trying to fight mobs, dying. etc.

And generally these are some of the issues I find with the game's day 1 experience for new players:

-They can't locate themselves on the map, and therefore don't know where they are going/should go.
-They can't craft at all. Because they need to go to location X to grab item Y which they have no idea about. So in order to experience crafting you need that information that mostly is given to you by other people. And I think new players should be able to get started early in the game without needing any other people's help (specially since there aren't many either).
-They will keep dying to NPCs. They might attempt to fight them and they will die. They might attempt to run away and they will also die (specially with the wolves added). 
-They will keep respawning in different random location after each death, and everytime, they'll have to keep running toward nowhere they know about.

So the game experience on a day 1 to a new player is mostly running in the middle of nowhere and dying.

And this experience doesn't even do justice to the game and hides most of its potential and offerings from new players.

My suggestions are the following:

-Allow crafting of some new items that do not require any prerequisite knowledge (or help from other players, specially since there aren't many that could help) by making usage of raw material that they can find in the surrounding area (e.g tree branches, leaves, rocks, ..)
One of the item that they could craft is some kind of wooden hut or tent made of branches (that maybe decays very fast) that will offer them a spawning point. This is very important because now, not only they will not just keep spawning in the middle of nowhere and keep running around, but they will intuitively explore around their spawn and therefore have an early strategy to play the game and try to learn the map and gradually explore the world around them.


I think that something like this can substantially improve new players retention and I think new features should take new players' day 1 experience in consideration (e.g the wolves feature made new players die quickly and more frequently which I think isn't helpful at all)
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#2
Making the game beginner friendly is a good idea and all. But for now I think the developer should focus on improving the base of the game and working to make it more "playable" everyday

Hopefully one day there would be some type of tutorial or something, but for now, hey, we all figured it out after a while, and so does everyone Smile
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#3
It would be nice if the game was more noob friendly, and it did used to be: players used to spawn with an ax and flashlight, and you didn't need a toolbox to build, so you could die and go right to building a base. Those items were removed because people were just dying to farm the items, and it was thought they made the game too easy. The toolbox was added afterwards to increase the difficulty for older players, but it also made it way too hard for a lot of new players because most don't know where to find them.

To go along with your idea of more structures that don't require the toolbox, having things spawn around the players like...
- Branches spawn in the woods (give 1 wood, or 1 branch if those are added)
- Leaf piles spawn in the woods (give 1 leaves if added, could be used for small structures or fires)
- Pile of planks spawning in towns (give 1 plank)
These wouldn't require anything to harvest, but would play an animation. The planks would also give more reason to go to the towns, and that could be nice, since the only reasons now are PvP, no one else is on, and you're new and don't know any better.

Choosing your spawn might help as well, let the player see the map to choose the general location of their spawn. The problem with this is it might make learn the map too easy instead of just easier.
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#4
I like the choosing spawn idea, and i dont see the problem with learn the map too easy, thats can be good for new player, and no affect veteran players.
In addition, that would give them the feeling of having a little control over their game, which would allow them not to get discouraged so soon,
and also, it seems that it would not be very difficult to implement it ...
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#5
(07-27-2019, 11:05 AM)sha1 Wrote: My suggestions are the following:

-Allow crafting of some new items that do not require any prerequisite knowledge (or help from other players, specially since there aren't many that could help) by making usage of raw material that they can find in the surrounding area (e.g tree branches, leaves, rocks, ..)
One of the item that they could craft is some kind of wooden hut or tent made of branches (that maybe decays very fast) that will offer them a spawning point...
I agree with your idea, the branches will serve the beginner to build a small hut, without the need for any tools, in addition, the branches could serve as a weapon to defend against zombies and wolves, of course they should give more range of attack to the branch, so that it has something of utility as a weapon, its damage can be low, so that more blows are required to eliminate some enemy, but the branches should appear frequently where there are trees.

This together with the idea that wild plants spawns in the forest (such as mushrooms, berries, tomatoes), would help beginners a lot and would not leave the game without giving it a chance to discover how great it is ...


P.D. 
The mushrooms would serve as a medpacks, and the berries and tomatoes for hunger and thirst, of course their power would be very little, so that many are required to cure / satisfy the player 100% ...

P.D.
Besides, I don't see the reason to try to make this game so difficult for beginners ...
For a game to be successful and fun, it must have a balance between challenge and skill ...


[Image: flow.png]
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#6
(07-27-2019, 02:37 PM)DarkCoder Wrote: Making the game beginner friendly is a good idea and all. But for now I think the developer should focus on improving the base of the game and working to make it more "playable" everyday

Hopefully one day there would be some type of tutorial or something, but for now, hey, we all figured it out after a while, and so does everyone Smile

Just to be clear, I don't think it's just about making the game beginner friendly. I believe the gameplay for a beginner is broken. 
And the broken part of it is this:

-As a new player, you can't craft anything, despite crafting being a major feature of the game.
-As a new player, the chances of you finding the tools you need to get started crafting is very small. Or atleast you'll have to run and die for hours without giving up. Even if you did, you'll probably die and lose everything again. You spawn somewhere else again, repeat the running and dying for hours. Impossible.
-As a new player, the chances of you locating yourself on the map or knowing where to go is near 0 unless another player helps you. Everytime you die it's a new random spawn and therefore repeat the process of trying to locate yourself.

Therefore the day 1 experience is running and dying and that's probably a rage quit. And I don't think that's what this game is trying to be so something is wrong. You can always improve the game but why keep it away from new players ? It's simply counter-intuitive.
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#7
(07-28-2019, 02:25 PM)sha1 Wrote:
(07-27-2019, 02:37 PM)DarkCoder Wrote: Making the game beginner friendly is a good idea and all. But for now I think the developer should focus on improving the base of the game and working to make it more "playable" everyday

Hopefully one day there would be some type of tutorial or something, but for now, hey, we all figured it out after a while, and so does everyone Smile

Just to be clear, I don't think it's just about making the game beginner friendly. I believe the gameplay for a beginner is broken. 
And the broken part of it is this:

-As a new player, you can't craft anything, despite crafting being a major feature of the game.
-As a new player, the chances of you finding the tools you need to get started crafting is very small. Or atleast you'll have to run and die for hours without giving up. Even if you did, you'll probably die and lose everything again. You spawn somewhere else again, repeat the running and dying for hours. Impossible.
-As a new player, the chances of you locating yourself on the map or knowing where to go is near 0 unless another player helps you. Everytime you die it's a new random spawn and therefore repeat the process of trying to locate yourself.

Therefore the day 1 experience is running and dying and that's probably a rage quit. And I don't think that's what this game is trying to be so something is wrong. You can always improve the game but why keep it away from new players ? It's simply counter-intuitive.

I agree with everything you've said. Your idea about collecting lower level materials and some crafting without tools is similar to one I had in the pinned suggestion thread (at the bottom of my post) https://www.survius.com/forums/thread-28...l#pid21676
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#8
I like this a lot.

So, in the woods you can find:
- branches
- leaves
- stones (not the big rocks)

This allows new players to build:
- a little hut (branches and leaves)
- a crude weapon (branches and stones)
- a crude axe (branches and stones)
- a camp fire (branches and stones)

Which would allow them to have a better start, farm wood (crude axe) and have a spawn point.

Then you can slowly upgrade your tools. When find enough stones, you can build a furnace. If you find scrap metal, you can smelt that in your furnace, so with branches and smelted metal you can create a real axe (they'd no longer spawn).

I already lowered that spawn rate for the wolves in the next build.


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#9
you could also leverage the existing small trees and bushes.

-many things that could spawn in bushes at different probabilities: wild berries, medicinal herb (or one of many components for crafting medicinal herb), toxic herb (which could be used to craft poison and then craft poisoned arrow head and give you a "poisoned" state or just sick if hit)

-small trees could give you the branches and leaves. a branch could be two things at different probabilities: normal branch(highly probability) or curved branch (low prob, curved branch could be used for crafting a bow in the future??).

-also the ability to drink using your hands from water. And it's always better if it had a probability say of 2/3 of getting sick instead of 100%. makes it more realistic. 

In any case, if you'd like to head this way then you'd probably want to think ahead and see how to balance things out, and guns and ammo should become a lot more scarce (you could even have gun components spawn instead of guns, and let people assemble gun component at for example an old factory at mil base where a ton of zombies spawn ...)
Houses will then have to spawn a diversity of stuff at different rates: like "damaged clothes" which could be used to get cloth or strings, for a bow for example, along with gun components/parts ....

But this goes beyond the scope of this thread.

important note: concerning the "F1" help guide, I always need to tell people to "use arrow buttons to navigate" because they can't tell (I personally couldn't tell until much later). Even the pop up that shows for 5sec isn't clear.
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